Okay, so I'll try to be as respectful as possible while still addressing your question. I can only speak for myself, as an agnostic. To clarify my beliefs, I do not know if there's an afterlife, or a God, etc. I'm willing to entertain theories, but that doesn't mean I accept any given one. I haven't found one that I totally agree with yet.
You're right that I think it doesn't do anything when you baptise a dead person. Similarly, you could stuff communal wafers into my kid's mouth all day and I wouldn't feel she's eaten the body of Christ, but I still don't want her being stuffed with wafers; and you could baptize everyone on earth and it wouldn't change a thing about our immortal destinies, or whatever. I don't object to my Dad praying for me, which he often says he's doing. I wouldn't object to people in your church praying for me. I would not like them to baptise me, however, alive or dead.
This may seem identical to you--prayer and baptism--but it's not. The concept of baptism feels different to those outside your faith because to most religions, baptism is a sacrament that is willingly undergone, and that changes them. You feel it changes them, too, or you wouldn't be doing it. So, it's offensive not because the baptised person would have felt that it had power over them, but rather that you think it has power over them and you're doing it without their consent, which in many cases they would not give. I don't want to be on a list of Mormons even if that list has no power to actually make me a Mormon. I similarly don't want to be on a list of, say, people who voted for Obama, or people who support the NRA, or people who bought Justin Beiber's album, even if I know the list is wrong. I'd politely ask to be removed. If I'm dead, I can't even politely ask.
If you have a chance to spread the good news to people during their lifetime, and they accept it, fine. But for the rest of us, assume we've heard the pitch, don't like it, and leave us and our immortal souls alone, please.
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timeasmymeasure
no subject
Date: 2012-03-17 04:40 pm (UTC)You're right that I think it doesn't do anything when you baptise a dead person. Similarly, you could stuff communal wafers into my kid's mouth all day and I wouldn't feel she's eaten the body of Christ, but I still don't want her being stuffed with wafers; and you could baptize everyone on earth and it wouldn't change a thing about our immortal destinies, or whatever. I don't object to my Dad praying for me, which he often says he's doing. I wouldn't object to people in your church praying for me. I would not like them to baptise me, however, alive or dead.
This may seem identical to you--prayer and baptism--but it's not. The concept of baptism feels different to those outside your faith because to most religions, baptism is a sacrament that is willingly undergone, and that changes them. You feel it changes them, too, or you wouldn't be doing it. So, it's offensive not because the baptised person would have felt that it had power over them, but rather that you think it has power over them and you're doing it without their consent, which in many cases they would not give. I don't want to be on a list of Mormons even if that list has no power to actually make me a Mormon. I similarly don't want to be on a list of, say, people who voted for Obama, or people who support the NRA, or people who bought Justin Beiber's album, even if I know the list is wrong. I'd politely ask to be removed. If I'm dead, I can't even politely ask.
If you have a chance to spread the good news to people during their lifetime, and they accept it, fine. But for the rest of us, assume we've heard the pitch, don't like it, and leave us and our immortal souls alone, please.